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Exclusive: Nissan officially slams Porsche cheat claim

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image Nissan is going public with the tyres used during the GT-R hot lap. Photo Gallery

Will show tyres and video as evidence, offers Porsche driving tips.

Nissan is standing firm on its claim to the production car lap record at the Nurburgring despite a blistering attack from Porsche.

And it has the tyres to prove it.

The German sports car maker accused Nissan of using special semi-race tyres when it set the Nurburgring benchmark at 7 minutes 29 seconds in April but the Japanese company is now going public with the actual Dunlop SP Sport 600 DSST CTT tyres used for the hot lap.

It is also offering video footage shot by the Japanese magazine 'Best Motoring" during the high-speed runs.

Nissan has also questioned the preparation of the customer GT-R used by Porsche for its in-house testing last month, where it claimed it could not get within 25 seconds of the Nissan time and that its 911 GT2 and Turbo were both quicker.

And, in a back-handed slap at Porsche, it has offered driving tips for anyone trying to get the best from a GT-R.

The man who led development of the Nissan supercar, chief engineer, Kazutoshi Mizuno, says the lap record car is a regular production GT-R.

“Testing a car with specialized parts such as unique tires or suspension has no meaning for us. The GT-R was designed from the start to be a supercar that could be driven anywhere, anytime and by anyone. For us, testing the car in standard production specification is far more relevant than creating a one-off vehicle that our customers cannot buy," Mizuno says.

Nissan has taken nearly a week to assemble the evidence it says clearly refutes the Porsche claims.

It has even offered to show the actual tyres from the record run, which were taken back by Sumitomo in Japan for promotional work, to prove they are identical to the rubber fitted to production cars.

"It is clear that there are some important facts that were not accurately represented," Nissan says in its official press release on the Porsche claims.

It states that the record run, by former F1 driver Toshio Suzuki, was even compromised by carrying around 50 kilograms of data logging equipment supplied by Marelli and camera equipment.

Without attacking Porsche directly, it has also questioned everything from the tyres on the customer car its rival used to its preparation and the skill of the driver - who Porsche describes as one of its chassis test engineers.

Nissan says there are two types of tyre fitted to the GT-R, and the clear inference from its reference to the Bridgestone Potenza RE070R is that these were fitted to the Porsche-run GT-R and not as quick on a track as the Dunlops it uses.

It has also indirectly questioned the preparation of Porsche's car by referring to the run-in and service procedure, as well as the special technique for driving the all-wheel drive supercar.

"We are aware that several auto makers have purchased the GT-R for their own testing and evaluation. Like all GT-R customers, we recommend that any auto maker buying a GT-R should follow the recommended run-in procedures, service schedules and maintenance to ensure the maximum performance from their car," Nissan says.

"In addition, we offer performance driving courses for prospective and current GT-R owners to help them get the best performance from their car. We would welcome the opportunity to help any auto manufacturer with understanding the full capabilities of the GT-R."

Nissan has gone into great detail on its work with the GT-R at the Nurburgring, including documenting its various track tests earlier this year and the method - the same one used by Sport Auto Magazine in Germany - it used to time the car.

And Mizuno even says the Nurburgring lap record was not the prime objective of the GT-R program.

“We have used circuits like the Nurburgring and Sendai extensively during the development of the GT-R. The fastest lap-time was never the objective but a simple parameter for us to measure the GT-R in a consistent way against other world class supercars," he says.

 

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Comments on this story

Displaying 3 of 45 comments

  • I have been a Porsche fan for the past 27 yrs, and still feel that Porsche are still the best production cars around. From what I have been told about the GT-R (Godzilla), they are a limited build. Nissan should have an independent body do to the time trials. and no matter what Porsche there is no substitute

    Carlo Posted on 14 October 2008 4:49pm
  • The boys from Porsche and Nissan can toss all the numbers around they like, but in the end, in Australia, if the numbers add up to more than 110 then expect to throw some numbers around with $ signs attached.

    Garry Jones of George Town Posted on 14 October 2008 4:46pm
  • Independent head-to-head test required please!

    Davey G of Sydney Posted on 14 October 2008 4:38pm
  • Many things could be different with the car Porsche imported for their test. Track temp of the day can make a couple of seconds difference; driver experience with the car for sure; the speed limiter set to 180k by default unless the GPS knows you are on a track - did they load the German maps instead of the USA ones? Tyre pressures, proper wheel alignment, camber and toe setup - showroom cars are rarely correct. There are way too many variables, but over a 7.3 minute track with over 70 corners a 25 second difference is believable. Porsche's effort is interesting for their own ego stoking but its hard to imagine they set up the GTR for maxiumum potential on the day.

    Clubman Posted on 14 October 2008 3:46pm
  • Regardless what the facts will be in the end, Nissan deserve a pat on the back for this vehicle that's for sure. However Porsche have led the way in all aspects of supercar technology for many years now and still have the credability to comand some respect. Be sure that we are hearing only part of the argument and that those that are involved in both parties aren't just a couple of idiots yelling Nissan Rulz from across the fence at Trade school.

    Doctor of SA Posted on 14 October 2008 3:34pm
  • lol Porsche. While I'm a fan from way back their cars are in need of modernising, as many other sportscar manufacturers have done. In todays paddock of beauties Porsche just aren't that spectacular anymore...ho hum stuff. I don't particularly think the Nissan is a great looking car either but in this case the air has a definite aroma of sour grapes. Stick it up em Nissan.

    Ben Dyson of Melbourne Posted on 14 October 2008 3:08pm
  • Cry me a river, Porka boys. Don't get me wrong, I like them, for a 40 y.o design, but get over it. Porsche isnt the be-all and end-all, and they are well behind others in terms of desireability. They can't even claim to be the 'poor man's super car' any more now that the GT-R has arrived. What's left now? Prestige? That's for narcissistic wankers and balding men with small appendiges and a matching mid-life crisis. Apparently, Wazza, you must be kidding if you think a Porsche will ever have the performance of a the Nissan...

    Bomber of Laos Posted on 14 October 2008 3:05pm
  • We'll never know the truth unless an independent body such as an international Motor Magazine, motor sport club or the two manufacturers themselves organise a shoot-out on the Nurburgring using the same three cars used in the tests.Interesting to see if either Porsche or Nissan would accept such a challenge or would they both be too chicken?

    lionel hurst of Brisbane Posted on 14 October 2008 3:03pm
  • It has been proven beyond doubt by almost every car magazine around the world that the GTR is far superior to the Porsche Turbo in test after test. Anyone still disputing this has their head in the sand. Porsche needs to just accept that they are an inferior, overpriced manufacturer of retro styled sports cars. Time for a new CEO Porsche - someone who can bring them into the new millenium.

    Reuben Buchanan of Sydney Posted on 14 October 2008 2:55pm
  • Let The Stig test both cars - and blow up the loser. Now that's what we all want to see.

    Tristan of Sydney Posted on 14 October 2008 2:46pm
  • Nissan are upset and why shouldn't they be? besides if Porsche had the best time, Nissan would be crying fowl.

    Anthony blyth of Merrylands, NSW Posted on 14 October 2008 2:41pm
  • I have already sold my porsche and i am awaiting delivery of my new GTR - i was in Japan and did a test run on a standard GTr with standard tyres - not only am i getting more power but $80 grand in my pocket and none of the bullshit service costs i was getting with my porche

    William of Sydney Posted on 14 October 2008 2:23pm
  • Can't wait for a real showdown on a real track with real racing conditions using stock cars modified for safety - other brands invited!

    hugh of syd Posted on 14 October 2008 1:34pm
  • Porsche 911's are is just a refined VW Beetle. Engineering wise they have done a fine job at taking a antiquated and limited design (rear engined with front struts, only recently upgraded the '80's viscous center diff to modern electronic diffs) and made it work amazingly well but one would expect that with decades of race development and production R&D;. The Boxter/Caymen have been repeatedly been proven to be easier and faster to drive consistently at the limit but Porsche has protected the 911 alter by keeping the power down in its other 'lesser' models. The only reason the 911 has survived is because of the experience and challenge of driving a rear engined car underwritten by a bunch of lawyers and doctors that prize image over performance and never use their car on the track anyways. Nissan started with a clean sheet and produced an optimized supercar with on road civility equal or better than Porsche. The interior may not be as posh but the materials used in the chassis where it counts are just as advanced if not more. An average hotshoe would not be able to hit 7:29 but a F1 driver that spent months developing the car is a heck of an upgrade.

    Umai Kakudo Posted on 14 October 2008 10:37am
  • Didn't the 2009 Corvette ZR1 just do a 7:26...

    Mr Lancer Posted on 14 October 2008 10:10am
  • Its about time all of the over-priced and under-powered prestige car companies have a reality check, good show Nissan I cant wait for what the japs do next! Kudos to the bogans who took the time to post

    Combustor of QLD Posted on 13 October 2008 4:17pm
  • Tillman, I highly doubt it, you must be kidding if you think a Nissan will ever have the prestige of a Porsche.

    Wazza Posted on 13 October 2008 1:40pm
  • Ugly pile of crap. I'd take any Porsche over that butt-ugly revolting slab of garbage any day1! Jap crap.

    Michael Rollins Posted on 12 October 2008 7:53pm
  • As if the Nissan was that much faster on standard tyres. What a croc. Anyone who thinks the time was legit is just plain stupid. It might cost half the price but it aint twice the car!

    Mick Edwards of The Shire Posted on 12 October 2008 6:03pm
  • Who really cares about both the Porsche or the Nissan most of us live in the real world and would never be able to afford those cars anyway.

    Ken Posted on 12 October 2008 11:55am
  • lol porsche are gay a car gets a better speed then them and the cry and call them cheaters. porsche should use the same tyres as the gt r did. WHAT GIRLS

    ry Posted on 11 October 2008 8:00pm
  • QUOTE: "Yeah, but how do we know they ARE the tires used on that exact run of 7 minutes 29 seconds? They could be the tires of another run that the GTR did of the Nurburgring - not necessarily a 7m 29 s run. Saying they are the tires quite frankly doesn’t prove anything. (Unless they have some sort of individual ‘tire code’ - like an engine vin number or something)." the tires actually DO have serial numbers

    lobomochilero of GTM Posted on 11 October 2008 2:21am
  • Well done to Nissan, poor sportsmanship by Porsche! The GTR is the benchmark around the ring! I would have to say that Nissan have created one of the best value for money vehicles on the market. Love to see a test around the ring with Porsche and Nissan side by side....I would imagine the Germans would be the only ones breaking a sweat smile.

    Kris of sydney Posted on 10 October 2008 6:33pm
  • price difference of the two performance if same should also indicate which car is better so only image? well that is for w..k.rs

    Dennis Koh of Sydney Posted on 10 October 2008 12:35pm
  • I love this comment.. "And, in a back-handed slap at Porsche, it has offered driving tips for anyone trying to get the best from a GT-R." A little ol' car company from the land of the rising sun.. the almighty Datsun, has conquered the ring in Porsche's backyard! Stop your bitching and paranoia and get back to the drawing board! Why they insist in sticking with an aged 911 design in beyond me. And for the records, the specially designed potenza tyres that are standard issue on the GTR are a very soft compound tyre.. similar to a semi slick.. so what the hell is Porsche on about?

    Peter North of Sydney Posted on 10 October 2008 11:47am
  • you're right J j! porssy cars are rich, eat & drink well, why would they want to be a LOOSE!

    e uu of w/wfalls Posted on 10 October 2008 11:27am
  • NISSAN (DATSUN) should stop all this "cheating" with their PINTARA (SKYLINE). They do not want to service grey imports and are very bitter about the imports. I believe this shyline is over priced, remember it is still a nissan.

    King Charlie of Here Posted on 10 October 2008 11:22am
  • Now Nissan put themselves on the position same as Porche. Increasing value of Nissan brand. Good market strategy.

    Tillman Posted on 10 October 2008 9:37am
  • PWND!

    MASTER CHIEF Posted on 10 October 2008 6:49am
  • Probably it's time for Nissan and Porsche to resolve this issue once and for all like a gentleman by having a re-run on Nurburgring lap for both cars, set on the same day, with the independent driver to test it. I'd really love to watch it.

    Martin Jonathan of Perth, WA Posted on 10 October 2008 12:29am
  • Porsche should really be ashamed of themselves. My respect meter for the P guys has gone down several notches as a result of their slandering.

    Joe Posted on 10 October 2008 12:23am
  • EAT THAT PORSCHE!!!! what are y ou guys going to do now, cry some more?

    tim Posted on 09 October 2008 10:07pm
  • How do you like the rebut from Nissan? Porsche? Anything else to say? pfffttt! All you people who doubt the GT-R, get a grip of yourself, it's not the tyres or whatsoever reason people wanna put, just have to accept the fact that this car is the new benchmark for all supercar makers to follow. It's not about the badge anymore, it's about the quality, performance and price.

    Frank Posted on 09 October 2008 9:20pm
  • Yeah, but how do we know they ARE the tires used on that exact run of 7 minutes 29 seconds? They could be the tires of another run that the GTR did of the Nurburgring - not necessarily a 7m 29 s run. Saying they are the tires quite frankly doesn’t prove anything. (Unless they have some sort of individual ‘tire code’ - like an engine vin number or something). I think the only way to solve this is for the GTR to run the Nurburgring again and be certified that it is the standard production version. This would prove once and for all whether the GTR lives up to its claim. It can't cost Nissan that much but I'm assuming there is a lengthy process to running your car officially round the Nurburgring. But if Nissan are so confident, they'd do it again no sweat. I mean why not - Porsche would get the beat down of its life.

    the alex of taringa Posted on 09 October 2008 8:20pm
  • Porsche cars are for fat rich CEO's that can't drive a car anyway. Most of them by automatics so quit your crying.

    justin larson Posted on 09 October 2008 5:07pm

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